206 thoughts on “Doctors Redux”

  1. Mini Friday Challenge people!

    How many of these *ahem* great men of God have you seen preach in person. Who ever has seen the most wins the Grand Prize.

    I can only claim one. “Dr.” Dan Martin.

        1. Some of these guys are “new” to the network that I used to be in. Sadly, I’ve even been to many of their churches too.

    1. I’m at 0 as best I can tell. Unless one of them spoke at a PCC chapel in my 4 years there (I’ve long since forgotten every single speaker they ever had, and glad to have done so). The 5 or so names I recognize are just from posts & comments on SFL over the years.

        1. Row monitor was great. I would nap, the whole row would nap, esp. when Dr. Mullineux preached. Man, that guy could knock out the whole chapel.

    2. I’ve never heard any of them speak, thankfully. Although I’ve had dozens of Keith Gomez’s minions come to my door in the last couple years.

      This is happening about a 90 minute drive from my house…but no, I will not be going to report for ya’ll, sorry. 😐

        1. Count yourself lucky. I live a few miles north of you (Cville), have been there for just 2.5 years, and have had them come by several times.

          To their credit, most of them have been quite nice. But I kinda stopped being polite the third time in 6 months they knocked during my daughter’s nap time.

    3. I don’t think I heard any of them: 1) we were in the GARBC and 2) we were in a small church not really near any large churches.

      Even when I went to GARBC conferences, though, I don’t remember the names of the speakers.

    4. I was interested in how many I’ve actually heard in person

      Bryan Sharp (seemed OK, but has some weird views on Revelation)
      Jim Vineyard (back in his heydey – at the time, I thought he was reasonable, and this may have been before he got off the reservation. These days, I understand, he gives too much information about his body and his illness)
      Bob Smith (seemed reasonable to me)

      So, I only get a three. But if you add men who’s sermon’s I’ve heard or whose books I’ve read, the list expands:

      Keith Gomez – an oaf, filled with his own importance
      Jeff Fugate – Big man on the anti-Schaap wagon
      Mickey Carter – If this is the man I’m thinking of, he’s a KJV nut, follower and defending of Gail Riplinger

      And men I’ve heard about:
      Larry Brown – (SFL) showman who smashes televisions
      Sam Gipp – (SFL) General nutjob, from what’s been written here
      Dennis Corle – runs Revival Fires, divorced (I think), bro of Jennie Nischik

      1. Brown- Smashes televisions, destroys hotel rooms, climbs on top of the pulpit and challenges Rick Warren to a “wraslin” match

        Vineyard0 My old MOG known for throwing around homophobic slurs, giving kids guns, promoting Ted Nugent, racist, and his never ending anti-PCC rants, plus his anti-CCM music rants. :mrgreen:

  2. This reminds me of the ads I used to see scattered around Times Square in NYC in the 80s, except they were strippers, not preachers, and it was “22 Hot Girls” and “22 Spicy Shows”.

    So, they’re 30 years or so behind the times in graphic design and layout.

        1. I’m in the ‘fooled by the date’ club as well. I actually couldn’t believe my eyes and had to do some double checking. That’s hilarious.

        2. Me too! And I’m with Darrell on this: Where is Jesus among all these sounding brasses and tinkling cymbals? It’s pretty obvious that the point is to see 22 men strut their stuff. The only hint at a topic for these “sizzling sermons” is “Equipping YOU For The Battle!” Who? Equipping in what way? For what battle? Is this fundamentalist jargon I haven’t encountered before?

        3. Put me in, too, for thinking he had pulled a poster from the past.

          @Jenny Islander: what is meant by Equipping You For the Battle” is “whipping up the people’s emotions into a frenzy so that they will ‘work hard’ for their pastor (go ‘soul-winning’ all the time)”

    1. Hmmm, maaaaybe that’s where they got the idea…
      22 Hot Girls, 22 Fiery Preachers, 22 Spicy Shows, 22 Sizzling Sermons… coincidence? 😈 πŸ‘Ώ
      Be interesting to know where these guys were hanging around 30 years ago, and what happened to those girls.
      You have to have something to regret, don’t you? :mrgreen:

  3. Baptist Boot Camp? I wonder what happens at Baptist Boot Camp? We know they are not running 2 miles and doing pushups.

    I would be willing to believe that they do Pizza runs.

    1. What happens at Baptist Boot Camp? The same thing that happens at a US Military Boot Camp. You get yelled at. A lot.

      The difference being that at Baptist Boot Camp after you are yelled at, you get to pay.

  4. Apathetic’s question about what happens at Baptist Boot Camp reminds me of something I’ve pondered for a while as a Baptist. Why, when we gather together, is there so much emphasis on TALKING? It’s evident here: “22 Fiery Preachers, 22 Sizzling Sermons.” Talk, talk, talk, TALK, talk, talk, talk. What about prayer — humbly coming together and seeking God’s face? What about some honest sharing (not that THAT’S ever gonna happen in fundie circles) about what’s going on in our lives — our aspirations, frustrations, struggles, needs? What about celebrating Communion together? What about simply spending some time in quiet listening, both alone and corporately? No, it’s all words, all talk, all about “princes of the pulpit” standing there thumping their big Bibles and largely telling us what we already know.

    Sorry I’m so cynical, but . . .

    1. Catholics aren’t the only ones who have “Princes of the Church.” And Evangelical “princes” are just as far removed as their Catholic brethren from the real concerns of the people in the pews. Evangelicals are probably more entertaining to listen to, though–provided you find being yelled at entertaining.

    2. I was at a “preachers gathering” (day of worthless sermons) trying to make some contacts when we were on deputation. (No dice-The board I was with was too liberal-non KJV and allowed CCM) They did have a prayer time in the middle of the day. The guy I was paired up with and I prayed too long. We got a lot of impatient looks when we finally quit. Silly me. I thought that was why they shared requests. I could tell from the background noise that most of these preachers were done in only a few minutes.

      I can’t remember for sure, but I think one of the “Doctors” above was one of the speakers.

      1. Sad to say, for all their bluster, these men don’t really believe in prayer – they think is for old ladies or shut-ins, or people who cannot “do” anything for the church. Prayer doesn’t increase the membership or the offerings… it’s the same reason they’re not big on Bible study; they’d rather you go out on membership drives soul-winning.

        Please forgive my cynicism.

  5. Quote from a fundie pastor who was jealous he didn’t get his honorary Dr. – “There are so many doctors in the ministry you would think God was sick.”

  6. What exactly *does* happen? Is it really just a bunch of sermons, or is the real draw of something like this in the opportunity to network (gossip)? I guess I’m used to professional conferences that have breakout sessions with various topics that pertain to my field–but what exactly are the attendees learning here?? And this is a serious question, I really want to understand.

    1. What I’ve always seen happen is that each “MOG” tries to out-preach the other. The “networking” does indeed happen. They each try to entertain the crowd more than the person before them and on and on it goes. πŸ‘Ώ

      1. How is “out preached” determined? A vote? The offering? Haymens? Rant length? Who yells the loudest? Best jokes? Applause meter? Most laughs? Most tears? Original material? The attendance? Response to the invitation?

        One Sunday morning a few weeks ago Jack Trieber announced that his son, Tim, would preach Sunday night and added something to this effect: “I don’t care if he out preaches me. Mrs. Trieber and I have always prayed that our children would far exceed what we’ve accomplished for the Lord.” πŸ™„

        Performance. Performance. Performance. Performance.

        Tim has a “hard act to follow” and I would not want to be in his shoes — especially if Jack stays on as pastor emertius (in the event he ever passes the crown).

    2. From my limited experience, it is a day of sermons bragging about what they have done and how you can do it also. I left one conference with the idea that the actual theme was “How you can look good and have a big ministry”.

      Many of the messages are just topical ramblings that throw in HAY-MAN attracting buzzwords such as KJV/King James/onlybibleamen?, wimmen dressin’ as huzzies, men with juray [jewelery], hair, Hollyweird movies, the horriblescopes in the newspaper, etc. I have heard all of these, and am happy to be free.

      1. Thanks–I remember reading one of those SOTL entries now; will have to go back and revisit. This is just so alien to me, as our IFB was a tiny church waaaay out in the boonies that practiced secondary separation to such an extent that our pastor didn’t go to any of these kinds of events. He was content to (mis)interpret the scriptures according to the voices in his head without any input or ideas from other nutjobs.

  7. I don’t want to go to Baptist Boot Camp! If I have an honorary doctorate from Old Paths University can I go to Baptist Officer Candidate School instead?

  8. Looks like hell with all of the fire!

    I can honestly say, our Sr. Pastor has a doctorate for Princeton, but we just call him Pastor Bob. We aren’t Baptist.

    1. Most people I know who have earned doctorates don’t insist on the use of the title except where custom warrants such (e.g., medical doctors, dentists, college professors). On the other hand, most clergy I know who have earned D.Min. degrees or who have been granted “donated dignity” (a D.D.) simply LOVE to be called “Doctor.”

      Well . . . Kiss my ring. Or something else. :mrgreen:

      1. My grandparents had a pastor friend who was called doctor, and he would use that title when getting a table at a restaurant because it would get his party seated sooner.

      2. On the complete opposite end of the scale, I know a man who *is* a medical doctor but still prefers not to use the title… I gather he feels uncomfortable using it outside of medical contexts.

    2. I knew a guy who had an earned doctor in the sciences. He went by the title ‘Doctor’, even with friends, even though he worked in a lab studying soil.

  9. Equipping you to fight*? hummm Never equipping you to know, love and serve the lord and others?

    *code word for yelling at congregation and condemning others

    1. Wow, That guys son does not even look that old. In fact the majority of the assistant pastors don’t look that old. The bus director and the Spanish pastor are the only ones that don’t look like they just got out of youth group.

  10. I have found this to be a pretty good general rule of thumb: People with an actual earned doctorate aren’t all that concerned that their title makes it’s way to every piece of printed material with their name on it.

      1. Brilliant web security there.

        I took a PHP class last fall, first time I ever even was exposed to how PHP works, and my final project had better security than that.

  11. This is the height of pomposity. “Dr” my ass. This is a slap in the face to all who have put in the time/effort to truly EARN a doctorate (which I have not). For as much as fundies say that they “don’t care what the ‘world’ thinks”, they certainly seem to take great pains to present themselves as “educated men”. This is misrepresentation at its apex. Anyone who even allows themselves to be addressed as “Dr” who has not earned that title is nothing more than a bald-faced liar.

        1. I’ve actually seen Dr. Dylan perform about 5 times. Some of them were great. In others, he seemed to be playing with pick-up bands that hadn’t practiced.

  12. Holy land of Goshen!! With all those “fiery preachers” manning the Sacred Desk in succession of each other i can only imagine the amount of fundy-equivalent “size comparing” 😯 😯 that will be taking place!! PRAAYYYYXZZZZZ THE MAN OF GID@!!!!

  13. I’ve heard three that I know of – but it’s been more than 20 years ago and my memory isn’t that good. Could have heard more at PCC just not sure.

    All those doctors won’t be able to cure the sick souls that are listening to them. That much is for sure.

  14. Wow. I lived less than a half hour from there and visited many churches, but I never went there. God surely protected me! It’s such a nice little town, too. tsk tsk 😐

  15. Don’t miss this!
    You won’t have a comparable opportunity to have 22 angry old white guys yell at you for, oh, at least a month.
    Unless, of course, you go down to the VFW hall near the end of Happy Hour.

  16. Have mercy Lord!
    How long Lord? How long will you allow this to go on? How long will you allow these performance types to take your name in vain?
    Lord, I know I am a wretch and in need of your Grace each and everyday so my sin is great as well, have mercy, Lord.

    But, how long will you put up with this nonsense? How many more will be drawn into performance churchianity, how many more will count on the emotionalism, and the church experience these pulpiteers hammer them with? How long Lord, how long will you allow graceless performance churchianity to be preached in your name?
    Have mercy Lord, have mercy.

    1. I’d say not too many more years as far as churchianity in Fundyland. Churchianity will always exist i think we all agree. But Findyland….well when the “Bastion” Fundy U is barely making enough money to keep the gate open and the “lord-hugh Leaders” are dying off or being led off then I’d say their end is nigh.

      1. I’m not so confident. In the last ten years the SBC has really let its guard down, and are welcoming their “eccentric” brothers with open arms. I suspect a much larger and more mainstream, but entirely unhealthy, expression of this culture in the next 20 years. (Witness the preacher worship at T4G, etc., and you will begin to realize the extent of the similarities)

        1. That probably has a lot to do with the decline of the SBC (something I honestly didn’t expect to see in my lifetime). The SBC peaked in membership and church attendance in about the 1980s, and has been shrinking since then (which the SBC does not publicize if it can help it). It has also been riven by schisms. As the national and regional Southern Baptist conferences have taken increasingly hardline stances on theological and social issues, quite a few Baptist churchs have disaffiliated with them.

        2. so when the “old guard” dies the current leaders are going to go into survival mode and for lack of a better term, get a new paint job and either change their external appearance or infiltrate those heathen new evangelical looking churches?

          I was fearful of that scenario while i was in college at “Ancient Evangelist University” but I never gave them the credit of having the ability. Is this really possible? πŸ‘Ώ

        3. Not only is it possible but is alread underway.
          The massive loss of young people has caused a crisis in both the evangelical and Fundamentalist camps. There is a movement starting to take place where the music is changing and some of the most strident rules are being set aside for the moment. All in an attempt to reimage their brands.

          At best it is akin to giving Fred Sandford’s old truck a new paint job.

          The basic formulas will stay the same only spruced up with some eye candy and re-packaged to attract and or keep people in the pews.

          We are also seeing an arrainged marriage of sorts between the Evangelicals and the Indy’s in an effort to survive the “great turning away.” Whatever it takes to ensure the mini$try $urvive$ and is able to $ustain offering$ and the power $tructure.

        4. As a reply to Don’s comments: listen to Dan Sweatt’s sermon “The Young and Restless”. It can be found here: http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=56091910360 He preached it at The Wild’s a few years back. It is his opinion of why young people are leaving the IFB. He blames a lot on Calvinists and their leadership. After listening, I recommend Kevin Bauder’s comments. http://sharperiron.org/2009/05/18/time-to-speak-up

          I think Sweatt missed the boat on this one. I don’t think it is because Calvinist leadership is better than IFB, but that people are leaving the IFB because of Biblical study and an understanding of true Scripture, whether they claim Calvinism, Arminianism, or Free-willism.

        5. Bro Wilver:

          The Neo-Calvinist machine has very good PR. They intentionally position themselves to absorb disaffected IFBers. In the earlier days of the FFF, some rather prominent New Calvinists either participated or lurked. People with titles in the SBC and other movements. They knew what they were doing. Not necessarily sinister but it was intentional.

          So the perception that the Calvinists are tearing down the IFB movement isn’t without warrant. But I would agree that it’s the IFBers themselves who made their young men want to leave in the first place. The New Calvinists just positioned themselves by the exit door, bechoned the guys out, and greeted them with handshake and a grin.

          Come here boy, have a cigar, you’re going to go far
          We call it riding the gravy train…

  17. I think having this meeting in a town named Bourbonnais is interesting and fitting because it seems that you would need a glass of bourbon just to get through this “revival.”

  18. Fun fundy fact: Dennis Corle divorced his first wife. I only mention that since it is a fundy cardinal sin……..unless you are a well known Mog.

    1. Apparently, it is only a sin if one is a Pastor (which is why he runs “Revival Fires” magazine.

      It sometimes makes me wonder if every IFB Evangelist is merely a disqualified pastor.

  19. Lol this would be an awesome “hit list” for someone looking to take down the Uber extreme IFB network. I guess it’s a good thing Al-Qaeda isn’t looking for them yet. πŸ˜†

  20. Trying to wrote new song for this event.

    Pray where you’re praying, don’t make a sound
    I know God’s watching, he’s watching
    All have communion, the kiddies can’t play
    People stop talking, talking
    Hey’men My sermon’s on fire

  21. The airfare alone has got to be tremendous. Most churches I know are struggling financially. You add love offerings food and travel expense together and your are probably in the 20k range. You could do a lot of good with that much money. Just saying.

  22. The only “Doctor” on that list that is the most recognized is the Comedian “Dr.” Larry Brown who is referred to as the “Jesse Duplantis of IFB’s”. There are tons of YouTube videos where Brown rants and raves on CCM, the way IFB kids dress etc. You may remember him best for climbing on top of the pulpit at Pastors School 2008 and then going on a tirade about hoe he “Blew the devil out of that crowd and got those kids saved and out of their britches” while Schaap couldn’t contain himself. Here is Brown at Pastors School 2011 paying tribute to Gallagher and smashing a television. I’m surprised Darrel hasn’t made a blog about this video or anything on Brown.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03q6c_mL6_4

        1. If I didn’t speak English I would have a hard time distinguishing this rant from Hitler’s Nuremburg rallies. The cadence of the Great Leader’s speech, the roars of assent from the crowds, it’s so similar that it’s a little bit frightening.

      1. Brown is lucky he didn’t get electrocuted when smashing the television ala Gallagher. Funny thing is Brown used to speak in prisons sometimes but ever since his buddy the Beloved got sent up the river, Brown no longer speaks in prisons but he did speak at Hammond recently saying how much Hyles was an influence on him and then went on to rip up Rick Warren and Craig Goeschel of LifeChurch.TV in Oklahoma City.

      1. The picture tube in an old TV IS a CRT (cathode ray tube). And yes, it’s quite dangerous to mess with one, since it can hold a big charge even when it is unplugged. Either Brown is a fool, or he had an electrician do something to this TV set before he took the ax to it. Even so, smasing the tube can still send shards of glass ricocheting everywhere. Did he have the congregation all put on safety goggles?

        1. Oh yeah! I always think CRT = comp monitors only, but yeah, def was TVs as well. I get the feeling he wasn’t long on taking precautions for his own life or anyone else’s either.

  23. I like how every picture looks like it could have been taken anytime between now and 1953. I wonder if that was what Paul meant when he said to be in the world but not of the world.

    I wonder if you can still call them Old Paths if they don’t actually progress through time. πŸ™„

    1. No, but just maybe they take you to a place outside of time and space… The Twilight Zone (excuse me while I go find a window, a clock, and a naked mannequin). πŸ˜€

  24. Plus good ‘ole Dr. Jim Vineyard of Windsor Hills Baptist and Oklahoma Baptist College lore is on that list too. He used to be a Hyles disciple and there is a popular rumor about the “Roadway Gang” at HAC where Vineyard and his “cronies” used to bully the week and defenseless who questioned Hyles and HAC.

    1. My sympathies. I can’t imagine being yelled at by that many jerks for that long–and having to sit there and pretend I liked it!

      The PP who compared these get-togethers to the local VFW hall at the end of Happy Hour got it on the nose, IMO. If any pastor or priest in the churches I have attended (ELCA and ECUSA) had gotten up and ranted and strutted and sprayed spit and smashed things the way these “doctors” do, we wishy-washy mainstream sheep would have assumed they were drunk! The most charitable explanation would have been a brain tumor, or a bad reaction to some medication they had to take for a chronic illness, or something. You don’t make a circus out of a sermon, for crying out loud!

    1. Ha! Old South circa 1920’s, Brother Where Art Thou!

      When they say they want to stay on the ‘Old Path’, they’re not kidding!

      This is ‘Old School/Hyles’ bunch of preachers. Won’t hear any expository preaching, no ‘deep lifers’ there! Just imaginary, oops, I mean honorary Dr’s yelling and foaming at the mouth, verbally kicking everyone in the pants to get the ‘numbers’ up and America back on track.

  25. A five day conference with 22 speakers. That means some days would have to have more than 4 speakers (assuming that the first and last days aren’t abbreviated due to arrival and departure times). If that’s factored in then the main days will have 5+!

    Who ever heard of a fundy keeping it under an hour? Now when they all have to impress each other, you have to assume they will all at least go 1.5 hours right? That means that at the VERY LEAST every day will have 5.5 hours of preaching, and that is a very conservative estimate.

    1. The way it normally goes is there will probably be two sermons in the morning, and tow sermons in the evening by the “special” speakers.

      Then the afternoon will be “Breakout” sessions. Since Fugate is there they will have a sesion on “How to start a Bus ministry on a Station Wagon budget” Many of the lesser knowns will be holding sessions on “How to reverence God by properly reverencing your Pastor”, “Youth Ministry in an MTV world”, “How a Christian should dress at home and before the world”, “How to grow your church” and many more.

      Finishing the evening with one or two speakers.

      Special music each evening with a special treat Friday eveing where they make it look like all the specuial singers for the week are “moved” by the Holy Spirit to come to the platform and perform a group song (funny how there always just enough microphones available for the moving of this spirit.)

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