Today I’d like to share a blog post from a fundamentalist pastor who was concerned for his soulwinning stamina and feared that he might be “losing it” due to the following thoughts and actions:
– Do these people understand what they did
– Did they really did get saved
– I began to judge wether they were ready
– I began to look for people who were really ready
– I was praying for the really perfectly ready person
– I stopped the salvation presentation when the circumstances were not perfect
– I looked for kids to ride the bus….that was enough
– I failed to bring the person to the sinners prayer
– Weeks and months past and I led very few people to the Lord
Of course, rather than thinking that maybe there’s a good reason why he was feeling uncomfortable with his favorite “bag ’em and tag ’em” technique he decided that the problem must be with himself.
So this is how he got back “on track” for soulwinning:
– The silent partner wanted to see someone get saved….I was now accountable to someone
– I presented the soulwinning plan and quit trying to read into the person wether they wanted to listen or not
– I just went after people even if they looked like they were not really ready
– I pray before I go but don’t spend much time praying while I am out on the field
– I press on with the plan of salvation until the people stop me
– I look for kids to ride the bus and use it as a soulwinning stop
– If I go a week without leading someone to the Lord….I start to worry
– I don’t ever want to lose it again
And what happened when he gloriously decided to ignore the internal sense that something was terribly wrong with what he was doing and embrace the cognitive dissonance of his favored outreach method?
– I spend time every week to go soulwinnng(sic)
– I win about 4 or 5 every week
– I have had some great experiences
– I realized that I all I have to do is present the plan
– I have some of the kids I lead to the Lord that are still riding the bus
– I have a husband and wife and kids still riding every week that I lead to the Lord in Octoer(sic) 2010
– Let us have some testimonies next week on some people who were saved
– If someone gets saved it doesn’t have to be a dramatic testimony, just share it with others
Well, there you go. I guess it must be working if all that stuff is going on. I mean if he’s getting five people saved every week and some of them are even still riding his bus as long as a whole year later then it’s all good.
Good Morning
Wow-That was a surprise. I never expected a first, since I’m at work most days from 6:40am to 6:40pm. I look forward to my cushion.
Anyway, to cease digression, aren’t we supposed to share the Gospel as we are going through the world? I don’t go “soulwinning” the way I was taught in my early fundy years. I have learned, though, that there are a lot of spiritually needy people out there who have questions about God, life, after-life, etc. And, if you befriend them and build a relationship not based on “believeeverythingIsayeventhoughyounevermetmebefore”they tend to listen and if you actually care about THEM, without the “another notch on the gun” mentality, you might even finish the Great Commission and get to disciple them. Cool!
That’s…heartbreaking. And a little sickening. “I win 4 or 5 every week”? No, sir. No, you don’t. The Lord saves. You’re just an instrument. The moment you thought you were doing the winning…what pride, and what a terrible, terrible burden, to think that you are responsible for the saving of souls. (Sigh)
If he is responsible to saving them, then he is also responsible for the souls which end up in hell too. Because, if they wind up in hell he must have said something wrong, misinterpreted something, or otherwise screwed up the encounter. That’s the bigger burden. That’s the one which keeps piling on the guilt.
I have seen that concept taught to preteens…ugh!
The blogger did clarify that he wasn’t anything more than a tool that God could use. That is the problem with reading/trusting a biased article against IFB soulwinning…
The first paragraph explains how I felt after many years of using this “bag ’em and tag ’em” technique. During that time I’d have doubts about whether or not people were really getting saved. I’d be as thorough as I could while presenting the plan of salvation, and many people seemed sincere, but when you’d try to follow up, they would conveniently not be at home. Or they’d make excuses not to follow through and come to church. In approximately 13 years I only had a couple “converts” actually come down the aisle and be baptized and only one joined the church. The children were easier to keep, but most of them pretty much stop coming when they get to the junior high years and become involved in other activities.
I remember one night a Hispanic friend and I went to the local migrant camp and supposedly won 21 people. We were very excited on the way back to the church, but somewhere along the way she said, “Did they really get saved?” That pretty much stopped me cold. I had the same doubts all the time.
After many years of these doubts I just couldn’t keep going and I stopped. Of course there were people who asked me why I wasn’t coming anymore. I couldn’t tell them the truth so I’d make up excuses. Eventually I think many people just thought I was backslidden. Whatever. 😥
What you said, but they told me to my face I was backslidden; I was shunned and ignored, and had a “special talking to” about not going out. I was told I would not be allowed to do anything at the church unless I went out on their “sell heaven” sales calling. I still didn’t go.
I wasn’t specifically talked to at this time, as it was back in my old church in Michigan. I was no longer active in any of the ministries (which is a long story in itself) so I wasn’t forbidden from taking part in anything, I did not volunteer for anything at this time.
But the story changed when we moved here and began attending another church. It was a smaller church and vastly different from the church in Michigan. The pastor was much more of a control freak. He decided who would do what and rather than preaching and allowing the Holy Spirit to lay on people’s hearts what He wanted them to do (as had been the case in Michigan) he would ask you to do something, and would anticipate a yes answer, as if you could not say no. The few times I did say no or express any kind of unwillingness I got the “look” that said I had to give in. Due to my husband and me feeling under obligation (another long story) I would give in.
Last year he gave me a class to teach that I did not want due to the fact that I am much more comfortable teaching older girls and he wanted me to teach little ones. I did this as a favor to him for that full year. My husband was teaching a boys’ class and seemed to be enjoying it.
However we had entirely stopped going “soul winning” mostly because it was on Saturday mornings and it’s hard to get up early two mornings in a row. And though we did go a few times I had the same feelings about it, that it was a load of falderal and did little good if any. So we quit going.
This past summer as the pastor was arranging who would teach what class he asked to meet with us. He told us that due to the fact that we had stopped going “soul winning” he wasn’t going to give us classes for this next year. We were to take the year off and be in the adult class while we “recharged our batteries.” My husband was insulted by this as he had enjoyed his class. I was simply relieved not to have the same class.
This is when my husband made the decision to leave. I had been unhappy there from the beginning and it had just built. It built with him much more slowly but when he decided to leave that was it, he was determined to be out of there. Then I was happy.
The Lord has led us to another church very quickly and though we have yet to become involved in anything here we anticipate that we will after the first of the year. I think things will be different. 🙂
Yup.
In Fundystan, you are a worthless, unprofitable servant if you do not work their soulwinning program. It matters not that you love your neighbor as yourself and personally witness to people during your normal daily life…You must show up and look the part during their organized soulwinning times.
But if you are a biblically ignorant jerk with a lousy testimony within the community who knows how to “play fundy” and goes soulwinning, you are worthy of teaching a class and singing in the choir.
Chuck Phelps let Ernie Willis serve in the church…I bet he was a soulwinner too. 🙄
4th?! Again?
Fundy hubris at its best. It’s all about me instead of all about God.
My favorite part of this entire post is the hover text.
Ugh. Yeah. When we went soulwinning in public areas, we tended to target nice, clean-looking people. Occasionally I’d try to look for alternative-looking people, someone with dreadlocks or dyed hair or something. Just to even out the demographic outreach a bit. It didn’t really work.
Too true. Don’t just look for someone “winnable”, look for someone who would make a good convert.
Notice too how he mentioned that a “husband and wife and their children” are still riding the bus. More points if an adult joins the church because of your efforts.
While serving an internship at a large church and fundy u, I was told that as a staff member, I am a liability to the church and not an asset until I added 10 tithing families to the church.
How would you like living with that on your conscience?
It was a very long, guilt filled summer.
I have been told my former pastor says that to his staff…His poor abused staff…
” I spend time every week to go soulwinnng(sic)
I win about 4 or 5 every week”
Typical fundy making himself the hero of every illustration. All glory be to him.
Even when in the IFB I used to HATE propaganda photos like the one above. 👿 I went soulwinning EVERY single day with a friend of mine and DESPIZED the thought of glamourizing a particular church/person/method whilethey were supposed to be doing very important work for the Lord.
I see the whole “soulwinning” thing in a different light now but still cringe when I see a person posed with “the lost” tract in hand hoping to end up on the big screen in front of an IFB congregation somewhere for glory points. 👿
“- Did they really did get saved
– I began to judge wether they were ready”
“Did they really did get saved”? And “wether”? Really?
In a rush to get back to soul-winning, can’t use spell-check.
Is this for real? Because if it is, it disturbs me. What happened to the supernatural working of the Holy Spirit in all this? Guess He’s not needed because we have a formula? *gag*
Sadly, this is for real… it’s all about salesmanship. The Holy Spirit is not depended upon to convict them of sin; the lost man is not required to repent — just pray the magic prayer and “you’re in!” (well, at least I get to count you, whether or not you actually have been saved).
It is this disastrous philosophy that is giving people false assurance, and (as one deacon put it) “messing with someone’s forever”!
The old fundy pastor of my old fundy church used to refer to people as “prospects” just like a salesperson. That used to always bug me. 🙄
I believe it. Replace “soulwinning” with “door-knocking” or “sharing your faith” (read: inviting everyone to church or a Bible study) and you have a picture of the Church of Christ I attended in college.
I went to their web site to check it out. On the Music Ministry page I found this quote, “When people think of LABC, they immediately think of Pastor Hobbins. The next thought that comes to mind is the music.” I wonder where Jesus fits on the list.
“…all I have to do is present the plan.”
Sounds like Amway. This guy needs to read some Scot McKnight.
The King Jesus Gospel in awesome.
I have referred to my former fundy church in Lancaster as an “Amway style church”…especially with how “warmly” visitors are greeted.
One of the major reasons I left my fundy church is that I often believe it or not have non-believers invite themselves to come to church with me out of curiosity and then they would come to the stifling, rigid, uninviting service and be intimidated and turned off and would never or rarely come back. God does provide many opportunities during the process of real life to share our faith with others with whom we develop relationships and it really helps to be a part of a church body that is alive, joyful, and down-to-earth and welcoming so that they can be a part in what God is doing in their heart. I believe in praying for people God puts in our lives and then when the prompting comes or they ask, testify! Praise God my mom is actually coming to a Christmas service with me this year, a FIRST. Pray that the Holy Spirt would convict her to believe on the Lord Jesus and be saved for God’s Glory, not mine. 😀
I think your point about ‘God provides the opportunities’ is an excellent one. We don’t have to force ourselves to manufacture opportunities.
“The buildings comprise 78,000 square feet, including the auditorium, Sunday School building, an educational wing, both an elementary and high school wing and a gymnasium building. An auditorium that seats 1300 was added under Pastor Hobbins’s leadership and a second educational wing will add 58,000 square feet when completed.
The land and buildings are valued in excess of 5.5 million dollars.”
A direct quote from the About page. I see they are independent and that they did a lot. One reference to claiming to be men of God because they are dedicated Fundamentalists, no Jesus references. Looks like a form of humanism to me.
Definitely a form of humanism. This quote is from their music ministry page: “When people think of LABC, they immediately think of Pastor Hobbins. The next thought that comes to mind is the music.” And here I thought church was about Jesus.
It’s another fundy family firm. Daddy was pastor for decades, now sonny has taken over. It’s all about numbers and assets and pride. All the “I”s in the blog post make clear who’s most important.
That’s why he’s got to win 5 souls a week; to help pay for the abundance God has given them.
IMHO Paul Chappell teaches this method of church (more like empire) building. Huge emphasis on organized soul-winning program (he has written his own program, which he sells to others – cha-ching!) with a constant building program.
Bring in new recruits constantly. Newer ones tend to be more fervent and not have enough of a normal Christian background to question you about stuff.
Get the whole congregation involved and give them the common goal of building the next building, coffee shop, whatever – stress that this new structure is necessary so that more folks can get saved (how pragmatic is that?). Always having a buzz of activity makes the place feel more exciting and makes the community wonder what else they are doing over there…but it causes many people to burn out.
With “three to thrive” and the constant demand to work the pastor’s soul-winning program new bodies are always coming in the door. While it is not mentioned publicly, the out door is quite busy too. Every once in a while I will go through our old church directories and will point at all the people who have left this dysfunctional church behind…the numbers are significant.
“Stewardship” *money* is mentioned constantly…but since the pastor does not make it the subject of many sermons, he can brag how he hardly ever preaches about giving. He just slips the topic into a good percentage of his sermons.
Churches that teach pragmatic works-sanctification are just exhausting.
We left a church where the pastor is a big Chappell fan. They send a large contingent to the leadership conference every year, follow the LBC Sunday school method, LBCers are often guest speakers, the pastor’s kids attend WCBC and so on.
The church had several soul winning programs throughout the week and those who don’t go are always made to feel guilty and inadequate during sermons. Yes, there is a constant stream of newbies. Yes, there is a constant stream of those who figure them out and leave.
Yes to the buzz of activity. “We are a busy church.” “We are a growing church.” (followed by a tag recognizing Christ) The building program created a bond. The big shiny new building was to better able us to do the Lord’s work, needed for the Christian day school, etc. (Everyone expected a huge jump in numbers at the school, but they are still hovering just over 100 after being in the new building for 2.5 years.) I think one reason we bonded over the building program is because we needed reassurance that we weren’t fools for giving money we didn’t have. I’m still sick and disgusted over that even though we didn’t completely fulfill our pledge commitment. It took me months to realize that God wasn’t going to cause some disaster to befall my family because we left and didn’t give the total amount pledged.
Three to thrive over and over and over and over again.
Every time our pastor talked money he would mention how he never talks about money. Things that make you go hmm?
Yes a LBC clone in Western PA, no doubt about it.
I am glad you are free!
IMHO Paul Chappell has branded himself like a business does – a pragmatic church growth guru. Whipping the peons into a frenzy with the constant activity and common purpose of building (I bet you heard a lot of sermons about rebuilding the walls of Jerusalem, Sanballot, etc.). Build the pastors kingdom and don’t get too concerned about the bodies left behind on the side of the road (former burned out and used members)…just keep bringing ’em in!
I pray more people figure this out.
Yes, lots of “rebuilding” sermons laced with guilt if we even considered improving the quality of life in our own homes or for our own families. The style is very passive aggressive. I too hope more people figure it out. Sometimes I get angry knowing that so many people who I care about are still wrapped up in the cult like religion of IFBism. They really believe that they are doing God’s work and doing it the Biblical way. Makes me angry, frustrated and sad all at the same time. 👿 🙄 😥
“I stopped the salvation presentation when the circumstances were not perfect.”
Wow. Just wow. Because Christ’s commands included to go to all the world and preach the gospel . . . if the circumstances were perfect. Somebody should have told the Apostles that.
“Preach the Gospel at all times, if neccessary use words.” St. Francis
Yeah, but Frank was a Mary Worshiper! And his whole “Brother Sun, Sister Moon” thing sounds awfully pagan…
let go Miranda…you can do it…
just more residue left from fundyland-
you’ve got to learn to take from him what you can,
and if you are not in agreement on another point,
ignore it. Heck, I’m not even in agreement with myself 100% of the time.
Growing up GARBC, I have found the catholic writers to be very spiritual (gasp!) Merton, Nouwen, Frank!
Oh no, I was joking! I actually am Catholic. My dogs even wear St. Francis medals! 😀
Poe’s Law, black sheep. Poe’s Law.
😀
“I win 4 or 5 every week”
Makes them sound like Bingo games or something. =\ I really really want to leave a comment saying, “That’s right, kick that Holy Spirit out–he doesn’t know anything. Bag ’em and tag ’em!”
Btw, his other blog posts are just as nauseating and written in the same format. Can’t separate a fundy pastor from his outlines any more than you can separate a leopard from his spots! 🙄
Notice how many sentences start with “I”. Sad, just sad!
He is just being honest…It really is all about him.
It reminded my of that old Toby Keith Song…
“I wanna talk about me;I wanna talk about I; I wanna talk about I, me, mine; What I think, what I like, what I want, what I see…”
Back in the days when books had to be type set, a preacher (?) went to the printers and told him that he was writing his autobiography. The printer told him it he’d have to wait while he ordered another case of capital I’s.
Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. Now this is triggering material.
I hate this stuff. I tend to be someone who tries to keep an eye on how engaged the other person is in the conversation and adjust what I’m talking about and how accordingly. It’s called being a GOOD CONVERSATIONALIST. So yeah, I sucked at soulwinning. It doesn’t take long for someone to express in their body language that they’re not excited about what you have to say. My natural inclination at that point is to the cut conversation short and move on – but no, you have to be “bold” and press on until they actually say “no.” Not a great way to treat your fellow human beings, in my opinion.
It’s not a conversation. It’s preaching at people when they didn’t ask to be preached to. Which is one of the worst kind of preaching to engage in.
It’s kind of like a contest — who’s going to win the “most rude” award – the “soul-winner” who keeps on going although the “sinner” has NO interest, or will the “sinner” actually interrupt the ceaseless flow to tell the “soul-winner” that he isn’t interested?
The whole not paying attnetion to whether (wether) the person wanted to listen or not really bothers me. So plain old rudeness will help spread the Gospel? Is that the point?
No matter what we do, including “soul-winning”, if we do not do it with love, it is WORTHLESS. Love, as described in Scripture, “doth not behave itself unseemly.” That means LOVE IS NOT RUDE!!!
Now of course in some situations rudeness is relative, but here he plainly says that he is pressing his message on people who aren’t interested.
I am grieved for those who hear his message and for him. He did start having doubts, but he decided to stuff those doubts and just redouble his efforts. I don’t think he even knows how his comments reek of self-focus and self-glorification.
He “wins” 4-5 per week.
Sorry, bud, but the neighborhood cats and dogs don’t count. ;op
How much you wanna bet the kid in the picture with him is from his church?
His grammer is horrible! Hooked on Phonics did not work for him!
Hooked on Phonics is a sinful, evil program. The term “hooked” is commonly used to describe drug addictions, and therefore contributes to the appearance of evil. A good fundy would know to avoid the appearance of evil. (and now I feel bad for even knowing that line).
I did the math. If I knock on 20 doors in 1 week on Saturday mornings, only about half (10) open the door. (A lot of people run errands or sleep in or walk their dogs or spend time with their kids on Saturday mornings, and I tell you, the devil is hard at work keeping sinners busy and preventing them from hearing us give the gospel.) Of those, half (5) of them refuse to listen and threaten to run us off the doorstep. Out of the 5 left, only 1 or 2 hear us out, get saved, or promise to check out our church next week. That’s 2 per week! And we’re not even sure all 2 are saved. But if we assume they did, and if I went soulwinning every single Saturday for the rest of my life, and there are 52 weeks in a year (assuming I don’t get sick or take vacations or take time off for Christmas), then that’s only 104 souls in a year. If I live to be 70, that gives me roughly 50 years to save souls, that means only 5,200 souls counted for the cause of Christ in my lifetime. Meanwhile, BILLIONS of people are dying and going straight to hell! All because I was too proud and lazy and hard-hearted and was only willing to give up my Saturday mornings to see souls saved. All because I thought it was too impolite to reach out to that co-worker, or because I was too scared to go out of my comfort zone and talk to that stranger at the bus stop, or because I just left a tract at the restaurant instead of actually talking to the waitress, or because I’d rather just stay home and watch the TV and have some dinner.
Friend, what kind of Christian is that? Jesus Christ didn’t stay home and watch football, he was out there preaching the gospel DAILY. Jesus Christ didn’t stay in his comfort zone. Can you imagine if he did? Jesus Christ DIED ON THE CROSS FOR OUR SINS, and you can bet that wasn’t in his comfort zone. Christ said to go ye into all the world and preach the gospel. 5,200 is not going into all the world. 5,200 is barely a fraction of the local public university student population. We live in one of the most populated, diverse areas in the nation, surrounded by professionals from every walk of life and we’re only reaching 5,200 people each? Every time you use your lunch break to just eat lunch instead of passing out tracts, you just may have sent another person straight to hell.
Friend, how’s your soulwinning efforts lately? Are you a Christian who goes the extra mile with compassion and reaches out to his neighbors? Or are you a lazy, hard-hearted Christian that is satisfied with the bare minimum? How’s your heart? Do you still hear the still, small voice of the Holy Spirit urging you to talk to that man, or that woman, who Christ died for just as for you and me? Or have you closed out the Holy Spirit and you’ve been filling your head with worldly junk and music and TV? Are you living a holy, separated, and consecrated life? Friend, I urge you to make it right at the altar today. Christ calls us to come and repent of our sins. Seal a decision with Christ today and let God know that you’re not going to be a 5,200 souls Christian. Every head bowed, every eye closed.
Senda, you are in trouble now. You have just plagiarized the Sunday sermons of about 5200 fundy pastors slated to be preached on January 1. (It makes a good guilt tripping message to start off the year right!)
Wow. You did this so well I was seeing myself sitting in my old church all those years feeling so guilty and hitting the altar as soon as he finally finished. What horrible wicked people we really are. 😥
I think I referenced Christ too much. A true fundy preacher would talk more about himself and DL Moody, JR Rice, Paul Chappell, etc.
Me, too!
Halfway through your post I broke out in hives for some reason.
That’s okay… I did too while writing it.
You HAD to have copied that from my IFB church!
I guess God would be screwed if we just so happened to get sick on a Saturday for soulwinning since He “can’t” seem to get folks saved any other way. Yep…I’m sure He’s going to hold us personally responsible for all those BILLIONS going to hell that somehow we just couldn’t get to in our lifetimes. 🙄
The fundy logic here is just stupifying. 😆
The blood is in your hands, exOBC. 😉
Yep I guess it is…too bad many thousands will die tonight but I just HAVE to play some Mondern Warfare 3 tonight.
Senda, I’m going to invoke Poe’s Law here, but I don’t think this sermon would be out of place in my church. I don’t disagree with the content on the surface, either.
All the same, I’m not going to browbeat, badger, or hard-sell anyone into repeating anything. Unless it’s ‘Ph’nglui mglw’nafh Cthulhu R’lyeh wgah’nagl fhtagn!’
At last!…a fellow Klingon.
Yeah, I think it’s a little on the fundyvangelical side. The farther I get away from fundyland, the more conservative Christians just kind of blur together…
Anyways, it’s the first sermon I’ve ever written. Give me a break.
“silent partner” = “dark passenger”
Dexter reference FTW! 😈
And, from the About page on their Christian school site:
“When State Line Christian School opened in 1973, Pastor Hobbins’s vision was to open not just a private school, but a Christian school, one that held the beliefs of Lewis Avenue Baptist Church and the other churches in the Greater Toledo area. The school is Baptist-based with a strong emphasis on evangelism.”
Good to know we have LABC to guide our Christianity. I thought that was why God gave us the Bible. What a great MOG Hobbin must be.
Did anyone else notice the nepotism? He was ‘following in the footsteps’ of his father’s 37 year ministry when he was ‘called’ to be the pastor. SHOCKER!!!
*barf* Hit and run evangelism, guaranteed to make the “soulwinner” feel righteous.
“Find ’em, win ’em, bring ’em, dunk ’em in the tank.”
All you need to know about baptism…
I had the same mindset as a college student telemarketer; the Holy Spirit wasn’t involved in my phone called methods either. All the false converts in Hobbins’ area would be a lot better off if he just “lost it.” I thank God that I “lost” the need to count sheep in church, and tally decisions outside of church.
A total stranger crosses your path, sticks a pamphlet into your face, and tells you that you ought to be worried about what happens when you die.
WHO ARE YOU? WHY SHOULD I LISTEN TO YOU??? oh, because you practiced. yeah, we practiced too before going out to meet complete strangers, in order to stick our Bibles into their faces…..aaaaah! 🙄
It wasn’t until I left my fundy U that I actually thought about that method of “soulwinning” from the standpoint of an unsaved person who was unfamiliar with the peculiar behavior of many fundies (and not “peculiar” in a good way). A stranger comes up to you and asks, “If you died today do you know where you would go?” Must sound really creepy to a lot of people. If I were them I might think, “Why? What are you planning on doing to me?”, certainly not “Oh, what must I do to be saved!”
Then again, having consideration for how a person might react to what you say or how you say it, or really caring about them as a person at all, is something that many fundies lack. You can give someone the gospel (even a stranger!) without being creepy or rude!
That reminds me of a story I heard once. A couple ladies were visiting another lady in the hospital and they asked her that question. The lady freaked out and said, “What do you know? What has the doctor told you? Has he told you I’m going to die?” and got very agitated. The ladies realized maybe they needed to rephrase the question. 😕
His blog made me feel tired just looking at it.
Lookit me I’m racking up treasure in heaven! I keep this up the rest of my life and god’s gonna have to take out a loan to pay for my reward.
Words are inadequate to express the contempt I have for this man-centered, works sanctification style of promoting decisional salvation. God/Jesus/Holy Spirit are merely brands referenced in the promotional ads. Guilt, manipulation and salesmanship are the tools of the trade.
The only thing I could think about while reading this was, “Do Right until the Stars fall.”
Guilt, guilt, guilt and more guilt. (to the tune of Monty Python’s “Spam” song.)
Honestly, I feel sorry for the guy. It feels like he kind of worked out that there’s something majorly wrong here. But he’s been brainwashed to the point that he just cannot, absolutely cannot, question his religion. Of course he can’t. His Daddy was a pastor before him. He’s been brainwashed since birth. He probably has absolutely no job qualifications besides ‘pastoring’ an IFB church. (Have to put that in quotation marks, I refuse to accept any IFB ‘pastor’ has a right to that title).
‘The subtle power of spiritual abuse’ points out that many people who perpetuate spiritual abuse are themselves victims of spiritual abuse.
And then there is THE question – if this guy thinks that salvation is something that HE does in saying a prayer and meaning it, has he actually trusted in Christ for his salvation at all?
Is this guy who’s the leader of a successful church himself saved?
Sad.
Hi I am a blowhard jamoke that harasses people into heaven…if needs be a holy head lock followed up with a gospel sucker punch will fool theses heathen into a relationship with Christ! AMEN
I sale Jesus better then Bob Barker can give away a car. Beware sorry little ghetto kids who barely speak a lick of english you don’t even know that there just another jewel in MY CROWN.
I’m going to get you, nab you off your razors and skate boards toss you in my old 70’s bus painted in gawd awful colors and give you the gospel gun. Then drop you off at Super Church where you will be taught by grossly ignorant leaders…you may get jacked by some other ghetto kid, you may even be molested by our pastor or janitor as a bonus.
Are you not thankful for my ministry to America! Who will go to America? I will, with my KJV bible, Baptist Slick, bus flyers and Chick Tracts!
In my former IFB identity I knew creppy guys like this 4-5 are all kids who just want to see the scary man go away…see the above pic
In my former IFB identity I knew creppy guys like this. The 4-5 “saved” are all kids who just want to see the scary man to go away. Ya, I pray your dumb prayer just don’t touch me when I close my eyes…see the above pic
All true
First off, how can these blog posts not have any comments on their page? 😈
Secondly, there is a second soul-winning post on his blog, authored by Bus Director Bob, which is also completely whacked:
http://pastorhobbins.wordpress.com/2011/09/06/does-it-pay-to-go-soulwinning-by-bus-director-bob/
Excerpts:
“Need some money? God has more money than the Queen. Show God your souls saved then ask for what you need”
“If I don’t tell is it my fault that they would go to hell”
How sick and twisted this man-centered philosophy is!
“Does it pay to go soulwinning?….if I go….IT WILL PAY”
This following quote sounds an awful lot like their faith-promise giving spiel…You know, that if you give to the faith promise program Gid will bless it – he’s just gotta. I have even been encouraged to pledge money I did not have to “show faith” – cause it is easy to pledge what you do have, but to pledge what you don’t takes faith…Ugh.
“Does it pay to go soulwinning?….if I go….IT WILL PAY”
I say it sincerely when I say that this man is pitiful… He is bound in a mentality that will only leave him tired and never feeling like he measures up to what God requires of him. Who knew that the Holy Spirit was on permanent leave and we all had to take up his slack?
I grew up GARBC too. Someone asked me what regular Baptist meant. I said we used prune juice for communion!
😆 😆 😆
I have a pastor friend who refers to people who evangelize like this as “religious vinyl siding salesmen.”
So he started wondering if the people understood what they did when they prayed the sinner’s prayer, and then just dismissed those thoughts??? Like who cares if they understand; at least I’M doing what I’m supposed to. 🙁
He writes:
” – I failed to bring the person to the sinners prayer
– Weeks and months past and I led very few people to the Lord”
It’s all about HIM. The Philippian jailer asked Paul what to do to be saved. The Ethiopian eunuch asked Philip if he could be baptized. But this pastor thinks he must be the one to BRING the person to the saying of the sinner’s prayer.
And then he’s worried that weeks have gone by without him personally leading someone to Christ? What about Paul saying that some plant and some water? This guy always wants to be the one seeing the fruit because it apparantly is all about HIM and what HE does.
:yes:
This is probably the most telling point:
“I win about 4 or 5 every week”
Win them to what, is the real question. You must have won them to the “gospel” of three piece suits, skirts and dresses, and tithing. Too bad that can’t save them from hell.
Then again, considering that only one or two of those 16-20 people supposedly won per month were ever heard from again by the church, it seems even that wasn’t successful. When are preachers like this going to realize that discipling new Christians according to the Bible is just as important as them accepting the (real) gospel?
Entirely off topic but that’s one of the nicest fundy websites I’ve seen.
I meant in design. It doesnt look tacky and cheap and obviously took time to put together. It also doesn’t look like one of the free websites so many fundies use.
“- I pray before I go but don’t spend much time praying while I am out on the field”
This says it all…
Multi level marketing. Even heaven is a pyramid scheme to a fundy.
It seems they try to win souls the same way they try to seduce women–obnoxiously and by force, if necessary, never taking “no” for an answer.
Okay, that was a low blow, I’ll admit.
For the record that blog post was by the bus director. Any posts on the blog that have smilies and poor grammar, and extreme IFB sayings are all from the bus director and are just copy and paste of the bus meeting handout.
What happened after the last post on Dec.14,2011? It is Mar. 28, 2012 now.
— Only those who are not true disciples will misunderstand the origional story. It is an encouragement to me. Only the not real disciple will not understand this verse –>
“If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.” (Luke 14:26)
Agree with me or you’re not saved!
That’s quite an argument you make there.
I grew up in this church(LABC) and school system (Steve Hobbins was in my class). All I can say is anything you want to know about this church..look at Hyles. LABC = Hyles. They were a duplicate copy church and very very close to the Hyles clan. Most of the schools teachers are Hyles graduates. Oh the stories…
Hey, it’s good to see you, Bob.