Changing Things (So That Things Stay The Same)

Through the last few years, SFL has generally taken a light-hearted approach to the issues surrounding fundamentalism and hopefully we’ll get back to that satiric dialog and gentle mockery within a few days. However, as the saga continues to unfold at FBC Hammond it continues to demonstrate and validate things that have been discussed on this site and others in a very real way.

For starters, David Gibbs and the CLA immediately became involved giving the lie to the idea that the CLA’s main focus is on being “legal missionaries” to help churches who are being oppressed by the forces of liberalism. Although there is demonstrably no persecution of the church here (because the harm was done by the church itself) yet the CLA still shows up to provide legal counsel. Part of this counsel has reportedly been to have the church staff start calling up people who had previously made allegations against Schaap in hopes that showing them concern now will keep them from suing the church. There is no doubt in my mind that the CLA continues to serve as the “fixers” of fundamentalism.

Part of this role as “fixers” at Hammond now involves conducting an internal investigation with all the unbridled energy of men building their own gallows. As the video above demonstrates, the internal investigation itself is more than a little troubling since church members are being told to contact in-house counsel with their concerns and information instead of being told to take that information directly to the police. In some other place with some other people that might not seem to ominous but with a group of people who from the outset have been less than truthful about this situation it smacks of trying to control what facts get out and who is told what. If you’re a member of FBC Hammond or a student at Hyles Anderson University, I’d strongly advise you to talk to the police first and talk to David Gibbs as little as humanly possible.

Although they are claiming to make “transparency” their watchword right now, truth certainly does not seem to be of much concern to the folks at FBC Hammond. First the church was told by Eddy Lapina that Schaap was sick and on medical leave. He apparently said this from the pulpit with a straight face even while he must have known by that point what the real reason for Schaap’s sudden departure was. Once the story broke, however, what does the church do but put the man who just lied to them all in place as interim pastor. Of course they did. Why wouldn’t they? If history is any judge then being able to lie well is practically in the job description.

I’m sure there’s much more to follow on this story as it unfolds and I don’t intend to make this venue a place to report on every gory detail (that’s what Facebook is for!) but it is rather validating to see the corruption of Hyles writ large upon this place through these events. It’s validating, and more than a little sad.

174 thoughts on “Changing Things (So That Things Stay The Same)”

  1. Where were all the ears to hear when Jack*ss Schaap was at least once a month belching out filth that had normal humans screaming “he’s a perv”, and FBCH’ers just kept Tammy Wynette style standing by their man. What exactly Bible is it they are reading up there that perv after perv skates through there and they keep announcing themselves as the most righteous institution on the planet? WTF. These people drive me INSANE!

  2. I am not happy this happened, but it does seem to give me a certain feeling that God has vindicated me. I was a friend to Jack Schaap before he took over the church. Later I was one of the people he screamed at, verbally abused and cussed at in his office. I can remember hanging for a bit after that and having to go see him about a girl I wanted to date and he humiliated me at that time telling me I was not good enough for that girl. He told me I would never make it and I would destroy some girl out there and he would not be a part of it. Fast forward almost a decade later – I am happily married, we pray and read our Bibles together, we go to a praise and worship church where we faithfully serve and I am not anything he belittled me about. I can remember when he working the bus route he claimed he built, but hardly ever road himself. I guess when your wife drops you off at the corner of Sibley and Indianapolis Blvd and you ride the bus two blocks in with the kids chanting bus 71 is the best bus is being a faithful bus worker…right? The man was so arrogant, so prideful, and so hurtful to me the last time we spoke. He lied to me that day and abused me once more with cursing. About 2 months ago, my current pastor tried to get me to write JS a letter trying to reconcile the old friendship. I could not do it and I am glad I did not.

    1. Your experiences shed new (not surprising) light on this man’s lack of character. I’m glad you escaped.

    2. I’m sorry you experienced those cruel words, and thankful that his curses were ineffective.

      I keep thinking of Sarah’s words to the Goblin King: “You have no power over me.”

    3. Sorry for your experience with this pathetic excuse for a human being. By now I’m sure you understand that people who berate others as he did do so out of fear, anger, and insecurity. Today we call them “bullies”. Your bully may be headed to prison if the FBI finds that he took the girl across state lines. Props to you for being a real man.

    4. Brian, as a pastor, I can tell you what your pastor was trying to do. By getting you to reconcile some hurtful feelings that you apparently still have, he was doing that for you not for JS. The resentment, anger, bitterness, hurt that we carry affects us the most. I was done horribly wrong by an employer and lied about once. It forced me to have to resign my job. I was angry! I wrote this long letter to the president of the company about the person that caused this. It was not a nice letter! After I finished the letter, I felt the Holy Spirit telling me to let it go. I tore it up and wrote to the individual instead. I wrote a simple letter of resignation and let them know that I was available for them if they ever needed Biblical counsel or prayer. By doing this, it freed me, it gave me peace. I know that every situation is different and dealt with differently, but hurt is hurt. Forgiveness is always the best solution!

  3. Did anyone else catch just before the 57 min mark, what was said. He asked everyone to applaud Gibbs. As everyone is applauding, I heard him say, “Let’s praise him”. Did anyone else catch that? Clearly at that point he was not talking about God. That was just creepy

  4. This was the FBCH Facebook page status:

    “Please pray for the services of FBC tomorrow. We’re looking forward to having an amazing Sunday.”

    Business as usual.

    1. And the deleted anybody’s comment within 5 minutes that wasn’t “We’re praying!” or “We love you guys!”

    2. Wish there would be a little more time of prayer, weeping, grief, fasting, public statements of regret and repentance, calling on God for mercy.

      “Yay! We’ll have an amazing Sunday!” is so shallow in light of what’s going on.

    3. I listened to the Wednesday night service where everything was announced, quite the jovial atmosphere in there. sickening.

  5. I had a problem with them saying they should pray for Jack Schaap that he would come to true repentance and he could still live a life that honors the Lord. They don’t treat women at all like that. Once you mess up as a women, you’re labeled and judged the rest of your life. Yet, they’re willing to forgive and forget? I don’t give a flying f*** what age the age of consent is. If its true she came to him for counseling and this is what he did for her, then he’s crazy and sick. He should be made to register as a sex predator/offender. If they don’t press charges, I’ll be extremely angry. If it was any other Joe Schmoe and not part of this patriarch cult, they’d be in jail and the book thrown at them. F*** Jack Schaap and all the other Deacons. I’ll happily drive the bus that takes them all to hell!

    1. Why are you so bitter? I don’t think you have a problem with the church sounds like you have a problem with God.

      1. a typical IFB response, straight out of the playbook.

        I mean we all know that the M-O-g and the ministry = god, right? If one has a problem with the ministry then it is natural to point out that their real problem is with God.
        M-O-g = Samuel and they are not rejecting Samuel they are rejecting God, right? Even if the ministry and the M-O-g are filled with error, and corruption, it is still God we have the problem with right? Right?

        If we would just learn to love the pastor and worship him like everyone else then we could continue to sip our koolaid in the comfort of our pews and call it worship. 🙄 🙄 🙄

    2. Becky,

      Certainly you qualify to drive the bus to Hell. A saved person knows he isn’t going to hell for any reason. Your help is much appreciated.


  7. I only listened from the 41:00 mark on, but what I heard smacks more of spin and damage control than of any real attempt to address wrongs or to help victims.

  8. Is it just me, or does it bug anyone else that the word “inappropriate” is generally used inappropriately these days?

    When I was a kid, the adjective “inappropriate” referred to something like using the salad fork to eat the meat course: “You used the inappropriate utensil.” We had workbook exercises with instructions to “Put the appropriate word in each blank.”

    Now “inappropriate” seems to refer almost exclusively to illegal sexual behavior, such as statutory rape, or sexual harrassment in a workplace, as when FBCH publicly stated that Jack Schaap was dismissed for having “an inappropriate relationship with a minor.” These things are more *appropriately* described as indecent or criminal.

  9. It’s been a long time since I sat in the office with Jack (Jacky Boy) Hyles and he counselsd me to leave a good school for one of his favorites. I was totally mesmorized by him, and horrified when years later I heard of his immoral life. Sounds like “Ichabod” has been written all over that church now for years!

  10. What do you all want the church to do roll over and die? Or get back up and march on for Christ. This ministry has done more for people than most contemporary churches combined. Every Church is full of sinners!!! Just because one fell doesn’t mean the church (people) should give up on their God. Please encourage and not discourage Christians to continue in their faith. Which is exactly what this Church has been taught to do!

    1. Of course, I hope that people continue in the faith. But continuing in the faith is not the same thing as continuing at FBC Hammond. When the people who “fall” are not held accountable for their actions, when the next person to be raised up as a leader is even worse than the first, when the innocent suffer and nobody seems to care then I would say that I hope the church does die. I hope it dies so in its place something new can be reborn. Perhaps a place where people can do justly, and love mercy, and walk with humility. But FBC Hammond is not such a place nor can it ever be if it hold the course on which it has been set for the last 50 years.

  11. From the Hammond RU site “If Pastor Schaap’s life had to be summed up in just one statement, it would be: Dr. Jack Schaap is a man
    who has a passion for God”…and Teenage girls..ahem

  12. I do not condone what Schaap did. It was wrong! It was sin! However, I applaud the church because they are stiill going on and still telling folks about Jesus. Bash him if you want to, but don’t bash his church. The truth is they and the young lady were the ones truly wronged. I hope they all realize that Schaap wronged them, not God. I hope they keeping telling people about Jesus and not become bitter people who can’t do anything for God. My prayers are with them!

    1. It’s hard to reconcile the fact that disturbing behavior has been going on for years at this chruch and just because the leader got caught, all of a sudden the church is once again pure and true and back on track for God??? You said it yourself, “Bash him if you want to, but don’t bash his church” and that is the crux of the problem, it is viewed as his church.

      If the church continues to do the samething it was doing in the same way it was doing it why should anyone expect different results?? Why should anyone view that ministry with anything but suspicion and contempt? To blame the leadership is to take the Nuremburg defense, “We didn’t know, we were just following orders, we were following the Man of god.” BTDT, and it’s no excuse.

      Truly there is nothing new under the sun…

      1. NO YOU DO BASH THE CHURCH..FBC is Broken…top to bottom… the whole IFB cult is broken…bullshit degrees if you can’t ‘teach’ or ‘preach’ at an IFB church you can’t compromise and do anything else or God forbid. HAC/PCC/WCBC … may not send their tour groups to recruit and harass your semi heathly wordly teens that piece of shit degree won’t even get you in the door at McDonalds…

  13. You forget they fired the man. Also, I’ve never known of a cult to fire their leader, and for the record I call the church I attend my church and I’m not even the pastor! I know several good people that go to that church and they are not the monsters you claim them to be. I wonder how many non-christians see this sight and want nothing to do with Christianity after reading it?

      1. Papa bear, I wonder how many non Christians have perceived your bitter spirit and rejected Christ? You will answer to God for that, Jack Schaap notwithstanding, brother.

        1. And, Baptist, I wonder how many non-Christians will see your chiding of Papa Bear and be turned away from Christianity?

          This can go on and on and on.

          Papa Bear’s point was that this BLOG is not the problem; rather it is the exaltation of man’s rules over Christ’s Gospel, the prideful arrogance that calls other Christians backslidden for not following IFB standards, and the prevalent covering-up and excusing of sin that often occurs in IFB churches.

  14. Every institution after the Penn State Scandal knows better than to cover up the sin. It’s damage control for the institution. If you listen to the Wed service, you wont hear compassion for poor teen girl anywhere in there. And then look who is the Interim Pastor! “We look forward to having an amazing Sunday!” Nothing substantial has changed, just the pervs passing the pews. My guess is Sick Schaap got the Shaft AFTER David Gibbs reminded them about similar Penn State problems if they didn’t. God help!

    1. Every institution after the Penn State Scandal knows better than to cover up the sin.


  15. I could not listen to Gibbs past his opening statement..was he placing everyone on the same level as J.S.Where is repentance for allowing this egomaniac to perform and teach his heresies. Where is the profound guilt for damage done to this girl and her family and possibly countless others.They are as guilty the deacons and hence the church is guilty.

  16. I love how the victim was never mentioned more or less, it just “let’s pray for “Dr. Schaap” and his family. What about the victim? what about her family? these people …

  17. I arrived May 24th into the RU program seeking help for substance abuses for almost 40 years. I built a home at 23 and made over $106,000 in 2001, while being caught up in drugs/alchohol. It only took me a week to feel the “cultish ” compound atmosphere. We are not permitted laptops nor cell phones or access to the library the first 4 months, therefore this is the very first I’ve read anyone elses thoughts. I (with my hand on the bible ) told 2 people at the fireworks nite at the collge that JS was going to be caught up in a sex scandle, I watched how everyone “worshipped” him, and noticed his continence and arrogance. Just a quess on my part ? or was it so evident. I also knew nothing about Hyles’ activities until reading this tonite. I was able to escape Brother Georges compound on Sunday. I’m clean but left after 102 days. Is this man got skeletons as well ? He’s awfully angry, most of the time and carries himself as if he has many objects inserted “where the sun don’t shine”. I expect more heads to roll, and someone needs to look into unfair labor laws (work up to 45 hours per week for 0 $, and supplied my own $200 per month for food) and speaking of the food crisis (maggots-outdated everything ) There also hadn’t had the bed bugs,ticks,fleas, roaches,scabbies, etc.. problem in the home handled either. I realise what a loser I’ve been, but still human . (I think)
    Good luck all, I NEVER want to see Hammond EVER again ! (or smell Gary Ind.) Mark Jones- OHIO

  18. I was a member of FBC during this time and foolishly trusted the church and attempted to report abuse. The first situations were mental and spiritual abuse, and the church staff seemed largely uninterested. After speaking to them for a few minutes I realized that they seemed to only be looking for claims that could affect them legally or financially. Emotional or spiritual abuse, regardless of the extent of the pain and harm it had caused to so many in many ways was of little importance to them. Since the church had publicly stated that if anyone had been hurt they should come forward and they would be helped, a girl, who as a teenager had ridden my Chicago area bus route and had been sexually and physically abused by a bus captain believed them. She thought she would finally be believed and receive help and counseling. She came to me to share all that had happened to her and it was horrific in many ways. We contacted the church to report what she had endured, but instead of finding love or hope or compassion, we were all re-victimized. We were told the only reason we would bring allegations against this man, who was and still is a active, well respected member of FBC, was because we were evil and were just making allegations up to make this good mans life miserable. When we confronted them with dates, times, places on the church property where she was raped and detailed facts, they finally conceded there had to be some truth to what we were saying, but their only response was to open a file and figure out how to handle this – as in how to prepare to defend themselves should there be some kind of suit against the church. At NO time did they offer the victims help, counseling, or a kind or loving word. This article was 100% on target and even prophetic – The more things have changed at FBC, the more they have stayed the same.

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