Why Do They Do It?

[lucrezaborgia]

I could totally be wrong here, but one thing I hear a lot when these people get exposed for major indiscretions is something along the lines of "but for the grace of god, anyone could do this" and that really bugs me. I get that we never really know what people are truly capable of, but that doesn't seem how that phrase is used. It seems, to me, to be used to excuse the action as something the devil made them do. I can't help but think that this mindset causes people to do bad things.

[NotUnderLaw]

(08-03-2012 11:28 PM)Jason B Wrote:  I know that other denominations have scandals but why are their so many in a movement that prides itself on doctrinal and moral purity?

The law was given, that sin might increase.

Where there is legalism, law and a focus on morality, rather than righteousness in Christ, sin increases. Everytime.

[WanderingTraveler]

(08-05-2012 04:00 PM)lucrezaborgia Wrote:  I could totally be wrong here, but one thing I hear a lot when these people get exposed for major indiscretions is something along the lines of "but for the grace of god, anyone could do this" and that really bugs me. I get that we never really know what people are truly capable of, but that doesn't seem how that phrase is used. It seems, to me, to be used to excuse the action as something the devil made them do. I can't help but think that this mindset causes people to do bad things.

I can't stand hearing that. Now, there are some sins that I know, if it were not for the grace of God, I could commit. But come on, your average person is not going to think that having a sexual relationship with a child is in anyway in the realm of normal.

[DestinyIsJoy]

I don't accept that religious philosophy at all. It's ludicrous and insults my intelligence. Are we all capable of sin in general? Sure. God knows how imperfect I am.

I find this a red herring that IFB leaders bring up when a leader falls into sexual sin--whether adultery, sexual abuse disingenuous. They piously declare, "There, but for the Grace of God go I. We are all sinners..." Really? Cuz if that is the truth, kick those leaders out! They are capable of luring a 16 year old bus kid into an affair when they are 54? Maybe they all are telling us something about themselves.

I am not capable of purposely harming a child--period--talk to my daughter, my child clients, talk to anyone about my passion. I am not capable of disowning my child...period. I am capable of lack of patience, lying, of losing my temper, of getting addicted to drugs if make the choice to take the first pill or shot...sure, capable of sin in general, but not some specific sins. The hideous thing about this philosophy is it makes any sin equal to any other sin. God does not. He has some sins he hates more than others. So. Do. I.

It is a red herring they use to cover crimes, to cover sin, to cover themselves. IMHO, FBC/HAC members have made FBC an idol...they will not leave...the church. Church is not a god, it is an institution God designed in the New Testament, but I believe if a church is enabling pedophiles and paying for their legal defense, SHUT THE DAMN THING DOWN--LEAVE. There are many non-IFB churches in the Northwest Indiana locations that are not harming their members once they lead them to the Lord and are maturing them into adult Christians who have a no tolerance policy. So, yeah, I hate that philosophy, too. Hmmmph.

[pastor's wife]

"There, but for the grace of God, go I."

I looked it up and found this to start with: http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/there...f-god.html

I find it interesting that the meaning expressed here was not that I am capable of committing any sin imaginable but rather that any misfortune might fall upon me. Thus it sounds as if the expression was originally used, for example, when someone developed a bad disease or their house was destroyed in a fire not when someone gave in to such horrible sin.

I could say of the hungry faces of children starving in another country, "There, but for the grace of God, go I", to indicate that I've been born in America by God's choice not my own, but to use it in reference to a criminal abusing another person contrary to the laws of God and our land sounds to me like someone trying to diminish the sin and even to put the blame perhaps on God, like "I didn't commit that sin because God's grace kept me back; he did, but that's because God's grace WASN'T helping him. So it's all God's fault anyway."

OK, I've just been musing aloud (well, through my fingers), but I'm intrigued by this thought.

Are we all capable of any sin no matter how terrible? If one answers yes, does that belief then make one look more forgivingly at a person who's done a reprehensible deed?

[Tbird]

Has anybody considered "predatory instinct"? Not to mention the ease in which a predator finds easy pickings? IFB churches have proven time and again to be havens for pedophiles and those with "unconventional" sexual preferences. Whatever they do, not only can the victim be intimidated into keeping quiet, but if a "sin" accidentally does get exposed, it's fairly easy to get it "under the blood". It never occurred to me until I read the blog post by "Honey Bear", a professed dominatrix, giving her personal assessment of Mack Ford (New Bethany Home for Girls). The tag "irresponsible sadist" fit this POS PERFECTLY.

http://theadventuresofhoneybear.blogspot...wrong.html

[DestinyIsJoy]

(08-05-2012 05:45 PM)pastors wife Wrote:  "There, but for the grace of God, go I."

I looked it up and found this to start with: http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/there...f-god.html

I find it interesting that the meaning expressed here was not that I am capable of committing any sin imaginable but rather than any misfortune might fall upon me. Thus it sounds as if the expression was originally used, for example, when someone developed a bad disease or their house was destroyed in a fire not when someone gave into such horrible sin.

I could say of the hungry faces of children starving in another country, "There, but for the grace of God, go I", to indicate that I've been born in America by God's choice not my own,

Thank you for sharing this. This seems to be more sensibly applied than applying the quote to sin...but it is applied in IFB circles--I've seen it online a lot connected to Schaap. Arghh...I feel like fire is shooting out of my eyes right now --not at you Pastor's Wife, but at those peons who toss the red herring around like a seal. Thanks ago for the info.

[auntdoc]

I knew of one IFB preacher wnd had multiple affairs with women in the church. While talking to one of the women who had an affair I asked her how they could both rationalize what they'd done. She said that he told her that God made him as he was and knew he needed more than I woman in his life. He was so arrogant in this belief that guilt didn't enter his mind. He thought he was above everything bec he and God had a special connection. I've never met or heard of one pastor who falls into sexual sin that isn't arrogant beyond belief. They feel entitled bec. they "serve God." Amazing isn't it? I'm so important to God He overlooks all.

[elfdream]

(08-08-2012 09:51 PM)auntdoc Wrote:  I knew of one IFB preacher wnd had multiple affairs with women in the church. While talking to one of the women who had an affair I asked her how they could both rationalize what they'd done. She said that he told her that God made him as he was and knew he needed more than I woman in his life. He was so arrogant in this belief that guilt didn't enter his mind. He thought he was above everything bec he and God had a special connection. I've never met or heard of one pastor who falls into sexual sin that isn't arrogant beyond belief. They feel entitled bec. they "serve God." Amazing isn't it? I'm so important to God He overlooks all.

And of course she believed him. How can people say this is not a cult?

That reminds me of what Frank Lloyd Wright said when he abandoned his first wife and family for another woman. According to him he was an artist and artists were above the rules made for normal people. Unfortunately that all turned terribly tragic.

[FmrMarine]

First, I think we need to separate child molestation from having affairs. Pursuing and engaging in sex with children is criminal and points to a fundamental sickness to me. Having said that, I think the reason some religious leaders have affairs is pretty basic. People who are attracted to those types of positions: CEO, government leader, quarterback, all exhibit alpha-male traits. The same guy who has the mentality to be a good secret service agent or Navy Seal is also the type of guy who wants to have a lot of sex with a variety of women. You see it all the time with men in positions of power and prestige. The same base instinct that makes a man pursue success and domination in business, sports, physicality and other leadership roles also drives them to pursue women.