IFB and their double standard on doctrinal separation

[TruthSeeker]

Most IFB churches today would separate from everyone who are not in their camp. Even separating among themselves over minor issues. But yet they praise men like Charles Spurgeon, Charles Finney, John Wesley, John Bunyan, Billy Sunday, etc.

Most IFB churches separate from christian contemporary music because they are against not only the music but the lyrics. But yet they use many hymns which were written not by IFB's but by Protestants who differ in their theology.

Also most IFB's are KJV Only separating from every other bible translation because they are "modernists" in the translation committees. But yet many IFB's use only the KJV even though it was translated by the Church of England. Anglicans are baby sprinklers and not baptistic.

It's bad to go to a movie theater but it's ok to rent them at a video store? Many more examples can be given but do you see the double standard on their doctrine of separation?

[greg]

This is exactly what happens when men look outside the scriptures to validate their beliefs.

Rock on Scripture Only!!!!!!!!!!

[TruthSeeker]

Is there a book refuting the separation of the IFB? I believe the doctrine of separation is the foundation of many IFB's legalistic teachings.

[Bob M]

(06-27-2012 06:38 PM)TruthSeeker Wrote:  Most IFB churches today would separate from everyone who are not in their camp. Even separating among themselves over minor issues. But yet they praise men like Charles Spurgeon, Charles Finney, John Wesley, John Bunyan, Billy Sunday, etc.

Most IFB churches separate from christian contemporary music because they are against not only the music but the lyrics. But yet they use many hymns which were written not by IFB's but by Protestants who differ in their theology.

Also most IFB's are KJV Only separating from every other bible translation because they are "modernists" in the translation committees. But yet many IFB's use only the KJV even though it was translated by the Church of England. Anglicans are baby sprinklers and not baptistic.

It's bad to go to a movie theater but it's ok to rent them at a video store? Many more examples can be given but do you see the double standard on their doctrine of separation?

Yes. Its a lot of cognitive dissonance. And in my opinion, the Pastors have to pound on those issues over and over so that people will not question them. It is very cult-like. Keep reminding them that pants on women is sin and they will eventually believe it.

Keep screaming that anyone other than IFB is a compromiser and they believe it.

[Papa Bear]

I remember being taught how great Martin Luther was because he separated from the RCC, and began the Protestant Reformation. But if a boy from the youth group wanted to date a Lutheran girl, he would be told he shouldn't, because Lutherans aren't Christians. We were taught to admire many Protestant leaders, but were taught that we were not Protestants, we were better than them, because our roots were not Catholic, "Trail of Blood" and all that. Our pastor and teachers would admit that there might be a few true but misguided believers in any denomination, but if a person was a member of a church that baptized babies, we should generally assume they weren't saved.

[Historian]

(07-11-2012 08:24 AM)Papa Bear Wrote:  ...[we were taught]... we were not Protestants, we were better than them, because our roots were not Catholic, "Trail of Blood" and all that.

Ah, the Trail of Blood. My favorite imaginary history! The Secret Society of True New Testament Baptist Christians who dropped off the face of the earth at the end of Acts, going into some secret hiding place where no one heard or saw anything about them till they suddenly popped up in the heretical Anabaptists. Obbe Philips was one of them, till their insanity drove him out. His records of what took place are quite telling:

"While Rothmann had a mere nine wives, Beukels took fifteen -- and Knipperdolling seventeen. 'King John' Beukels had deserted a wife in Leyden; had next married the beautiful young widow of Matthys; and then soon had a whole harem. A 'law' was passed, forcing all women under a certain age to marry -- under pain of capital punishment. Quarrels among plural wives were also capitally punished...One insurrection followed another." Seven 'naked walkers' in Amsterdam during February 1535 proclaimed the 'naked truth' of an apocalyptic (end time) judgment and the coming of a communistic paradise. "here the 'godless' would meet their end, and be punished. --...The most prominent in Muenster, were John Matthys and John of Leyden… John Matthys was so fierce and bloodthirsty, that he brought various people to their deaths...

I shall be silent about all the false commissions, prophecies, visions, dreams, revelations and unspeakable spiritual pride which immediately from the first hour stole in among the brethren.... As soon as anyone was 'baptized' he was at once a 'pious Christian' -- and slandered all people and admitted no one on earth to be good but himself and his fellow brethren. Was that not a great and terrible pride? And who can express the great ... debating and arguing....A reasonable, impartial Christian may truly say that it is no Christian congregation but a desolate abomination -- that it can be no temple of God but a cave of murderers full of hate, envy, jealousy, spiritual pride, pseudo-piety, hypocrisy, contempt, defamation. They could suffer neither the love nor benefit of another who was not of their belief.”

And who can forget that Anabaptist Hero, Meno Simons, who said Christians should regard infant baptism as "the baptism of the antichrist…we must resist infant baptism not only with our mouth, but also unto blood and death." And then there was pious and gentle Thomas Muenzer, who signed all his letters: "Muenzer with the hammer. Let not the saint's sword grow cold from blood!"

Anabaptists were persecuted because they were murders, polygamists, insurrectionists and troublemakers. It wasn't Calvinists and Catholics coming down on them: everyone came down on them because they stirred up rebellions that got people killed and treated women like dirt–unless they were prophetesses, in which case they felt free to wander naked down the street repeated their ravings. After civil, sensible society cracked down on them, the Anabaptist eventually calmed down and became quite peaceful, if secluded. But what they never want to tell you is that the lion's share of their persecution came during the early years when they were running around calling for the blood of people who didn't agree with them.

Hmmmm. Perhaps certain strains of the IFB movement actually are descended from the Anabaptists, even if they don't deny the Trinity like their ancient ancestors.

[pastor's wife]

(07-11-2012 08:42 AM)Historian Wrote:  As soon as anyone was 'baptized' he was at once a 'pious Christian' -- and slandered all people and admitted no one on earth to be good but himself and his fellow brethren. Was that not a great and terrible pride?"

Doesn't THAT especially sound familiar?!

The double standard is frustrating. I would read missionary biographies and hymn histories and realize how so many of those people came from different backgrounds and wonder why we could admire and respect THEM but despise and separate from other believers today. I wanted that sense of the universal church, that I could love other Christians even though we disagreed on some issues.

It's such a negative spirit to be always looking for what one DOESN'T like about another person. When I first started reading C. S. Lewis, my parents warned me not to read him because he was Anglican. (Actually, a few months ago, I'd posted some Lewis quotes on facebook and a pastor's wife sent me a personal message warning me that Lewis taught heresy and sending me a link to a site that claimed Lewis wasn't even a Christian.) At my parents' last visit, I saw an old book about the crucifixion in their car and picked it up (I love books); immediately my mom said, "Oh, that's not good. He's a Calvinist." I just HATE that attitude; why can't they respect and enjoy the GOOD about other people, instead of focusing on where they disagree and choosing to dislike them based on that?

[myotch]

It's a franchise business.

Church of McDonald's doesn't want you to go to Church of Burger King.

Church of MacDonald's doesn't mind - actually encourages you - to go to Church of McDonald's when you travel.

Bob's Church of McDonald's does not want to you spend money at Fred's Church of McDonald's in the same zip code.

[True Fundy]

Sadly, many IFB never truly grasp what it means to actually have a relationship with Jesus Christ. If one is truly born again and is serious about their faith, they will automatically begin to live it. We don't need to preach about standards (most which we can never perfectly keep anyway) - we need to preach Jesus.

[bean]

@papabear: Lutherans aren't Christians? Nobody told me
(I know it's you repeating a point, and not your point...)