Punishment of Believers!

[B-Ray]

okay, help here, im boggled. How can you get rewarded for good works, then loose them, chastised, and even killed by God. Altogether seems contradicting.

When you take into account the fact that all my sins were forgiven at Calvary. If so, then why would i loose my reward in heaven for sinning. And how is God going to judge for the deeds done in my body whether good or evil if they have all been forgiven?

[NotUnderLaw]

I have a feeling you are writing this under pretense, but that's okay. I've been there before.

http://www.andrewfarley.org/ng-book-info

http://www.andrewfarley.org/chapter-by-chapter

This book attempts to answer those questions. I really enjoyed the book. His conclusions are different to what you might think.

Personally, I don't believe God "punishes" believers, I believe chastisement is not the same as punishment (since punishment is done out of a spirit of vengeance and chastisement has the intention of teaching). I don't believe we receive or lose rewards (there is actually no mention of rewards plural in the Bible. Just a reward, singular). And I believe all of my sin is forgiven entirely.

Which begs the question "What motivates me to not sin, if there is no punishment and it is all forgiven".

Grace - The Grace of God teaches me to live righteously, soberly in this present world (Titus 2:12)

The people that do teach this "in and out of fellowship, gain rewards, lose rewards, get killed by God and enter heaven with nothing" theology are confused and contradict themselves. It also makes eternity about us and the size of our mansion, instead of Jesus.

[Derek]

Yet another loaded question. Can we get some clarification.... Are you referring that you can lose your salvation? Or are you asking how we will be judged/rewarded once we get to heaven as believers.

Quote:Which begs the question "What motivates me to not sin, if there is no punishment and it is all forgiven".

Paul answers this question in Romans 6, though he starts the discussion in the proceeding chapter. Succinctly, no we do not continue to sin knowing we will be forgiven.

[co_heir]

(05-02-2012 09:26 AM)Derek Wrote:  

Quote:Which begs the question "What motivates me to not sin, if there is no punishment and it is all forgiven".

Paul answers this question in Romans 6, though he starts the discussion in the proceeding chapter. Succinctly, no we do not continue to sin knowing we will be forgiven.

Exactly. If we truly understand grace, we will live as those who are dead to sin. Not that we'll be perfect, but grace will lead us to repent when we do sin. We don't repent in order to gain grace (be right with God, avoid punishment, keep rewards, etc.), we repent because God gives us grace. There is nothing we can do that will make our Father love us less.

[NotUnderLaw]

Yeah, I was asking the question rhetorically. I answered it in the next sentence

"Grace - The Grace of God teaches me to live righteously, soberly in this present world (Titus 2:12)"

[Bob M]

(05-01-2012 08:40 PM)NotUnderLaw Wrote:  I have a feeling you are writing this under pretense, but that's okay. I've been there before.

I got that feeling with BroBilly Ray's first post.

However, if you are genuine, Bro Billy Ray, your question is a good one.

And it would take me a while to answer it.

My first comment is this: That understanding of Scripture is wrong. The part where you are saved by grace, then you work for rewards. If you understand what salvation is, and all that goes along with it, "rewards" are what you get. You don't believe to get saved, then pull yourself up by the bootstraps and serve God and see if you can get some rewards in heaven. That would bring glory to you, not God, and God said "My glory I will not give to another." Isaiah 48:11.

There is much more, but let me ask this question, and you can ask the mannagawd this. What rewards are there that could top being in the presence of the infinite God forever. You would forever be learning new things, seeing new beauties, experiencing new glorious truths and a million other wonderful things about God. What is greater than that?

[NotUnderLaw]

Amen to that. This theology of turning 1 Cor 3 into some kind of heavenly game show puts an eternal focus on us and what we have accomplished and how we will be able to show off our mansion in the Heavenly Hills, while other people are just chilling in the slums of heaven, 10 crowded in a room for all eternity , and I've heard some baptist preachers talk about how some people won't enjoy heaven which is ludicrous!.

The only reason I want to go to heaven is because Jesus is there.

[Derek]

(05-02-2012 02:48 PM)NotUnderLaw Wrote:  Yeah, I was asking the question rhetorically. I answered it in the next sentence

"Grace - The Grace of God teaches me to live righteously, soberly in this present world (Titus 2:12)"

I know, I was just reaffriming the answer.