forgiveness

[mounty]

This is something I've grappled with for months and I haven't found an answer in all my reading. I think I may still have fundy glasses on and that's coloring what I read, which is why I'm not finding answers to a question that's been stirring for a while. It's about day-to-day forgiveness. As background, months before I left my position as staff at Fundy U and my life as a fundy in general, I found myself reading Hebrews 10 four times straight through during yet another legalistic, depressing chapel hour. What I read described the OT High Priest's job: collect offerings for the collective sin of the people for that year, sacrifice, and atone for everyone's lists of sins. Once that's done, they're good to go until they start sinning again, building up a list that will need to be taken care of this time next year. This goes on year after year, sacrifices that can never end, sins that constantly need forgiving. BUT THEN, Christ came as a perfect High Priest, did away with all that, and gave a perfect sacrifice that was done once and stands forever as sufficient for all the sins of all the people throughout all of time. It's a beautiful chapter, and it brought tears to my eyes thinking of the ramifications of once-and-done, forever seated (not standing!) at the throne.

Then I started thinking about what I've heard sermon after sermon about constantly confessing our sins to God, and I gotta say, suddenly that didn't sound right. If I've already been forgiven, completely, fully, why would I need to pull up a list of the day's sins each night and confess them? Aren't they already forgiven? Does it in any way cheapen salvation to constantly rehash my sins to God, as if I'm saying, "God, look, I know you've forgiven me already, but I'm not so sure about it so I'll ask you for one-off forgiveness for each of these sins"?

I'm not saying we can sin with abandon because hey, we've been forgiven! That's clearly against Scripture (cf. Rom. 6). But I'm no longer convinced that this obsession with "keeping a short account" or confessing everything before you go to sleep at night is really a Biblical practice. But on the other hand, if not that, I'm not sure what the appropriate response from me to God should be when I sin.

Anyone? Something doesn't add up for me, but there have got to be people here who have come to a conclusion on the matter.

[Darrell]

Quote:If I've already been forgiven, completely, fully, why would I need to pull up a list of the day's sins each night and confess them? Aren't they already forgiven?

Yes. What I pray for is a renewed focus and help for tomorrow's struggle against the world, flesh, and devil not forgiveness for today's sins. Those were taken care of a long time ago.

[Tooktheredpill]

Quote:Those were taken care of a long time ago.

But why do we have 1 John 1:9 then?

[JimE]

God knows everything, past, present, future. God covered it all at the cross.
As I become aware of my daily sin, I can approach God in prayer for forgiveness and grace.
I already know that before I sinned, I was already forgiven. It is an exercise for my self that I do.
I do not believe that I have surprised God in any way. I am simply acknowledging to God that he is God,
that I am not perfect and so much in need of his mercy and grace.

[pastor's wife]

Excellent question to ponder. I definitely think it's wrong to always be morbidly fearful that we haven't confessed some hidden sin so God is displeased with us and won't bless us because we're already forgiven in Christ, yet I do wish to express my sorrow to God when I do sin.

I'm wondering if the parable of the Prodigal Son fits in here somehow. He came back with an admission of wrong, yet before he could even finish it, the father welcomed him, embraced him, and called for a celebration. Maybe it's right to say we're sorry to the Lord yet also be completely aware that we're forgiven and accepted.

[mounty]

Thanks for the replies, guys. Good stuff to chew on.

Someone brought up I John 1:9 and I have to admit that one was a BIG question mark for me. But it seems like that chapter is talking about our overall relationship towards Christ: light vs. dark, self-righteousness vs. God's righteousness. So the idea is that if we think we are light, or that we are without sin, we're deceiving ourselves because we're really in the dark, with sin. But if we confess that sin, God forgives it all and brings us into the light. I see that as dove-tailing with Hebrews 10, not in opposition. IOW, I John 1:9 is at the point of salvation.

[GrooveisintheHeart]

There have been really good points made already but here are my thoughts on the subject. To me it is more about acknowledging the sins to myself than telling God about because He already knows I've done it. Kind of like if I catch my nephew doing something he isn't supposed to, I would like for him to admit/acknowledge what he has done but he's forgiven even before that.

[Darrell]

Quote:But why do we have 1 John 1:9 then?

What does 1 John 1 say exactly?

Quote:5This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. 6If we say we have fellowship with him while we walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin. 8If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

I don't really understand anything in this passage to indicate that Christians are constantly re-confessing and being re-cleaned.

Now I do agree that there is benefit to understanding how we have fallen and missed the mark but not so we can go and beg for forgiveness but so that we can acknowledge that we are weak and in need of grace. Paul gives a great picture of this struggle in Romans 7:19

Quote:For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I keep on doing.

We live in a fallen state. Yet Paul's conclusion is not "so I keep begging God to forgive me again!" but rather

Quote:"Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 2For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death.

Amen and Amen.

[pastor's wife]

@Darrell, living the way you described would give believers joy! Joy is one of the fruits of the Spirit, but I didn't see much of it in my IFB circles. I know for myself I was often, especially as a teenager and college student, wracked with guilt that I wasn't doing enough or dedicated enough. I WAS worried that I had unconfessed sin that would separate me from living effectively for Christ.

Constant fear and worry and guilt does NOT produce joy. Knowing we are forgiven and free from condemnation DOES! Perfect love casts out fear. I wish I'd spent a lot less time singing songs like "Is Your All on the Altar" and more praise and worship songs that exalt Christ for redeeming me and setting me free!

[exIFB]

I tend to agree with Darrell

1 John 1:9 and 7 definitely say ALL sin and ALL unrighteousness. It's talking about a repentance of self, a change of mind about who we are and a confession to God that we are wrong, and He is right, and we need Him. It's an admission of guilt.

I don't believe a believer is ever "out of fellowship" when they sin. Being out of fellowship means being in darkness, according to 1 John 1:6 & 8. And someone in darkness is not in Christ, because in Him is no darkness at all.

In Christ my sins are all forgiven, and I am always in the light, I have been cleansed, once for all, as Hebrews says.