The Local Church

[JordanMaria]

(02-02-2011 03:44 PM)TruthSeeker Wrote:  An IFB pastor defends the doctrine of the local church. I'm hoping someone can review this book for us and tell us if this pastor is a landmarker.
You can read it online.


http://gardenstatebaptistchurch.org/docs...church.pdf

Holy Crap. I went to this church. I think my family went there for... 4 or 5 years, and and I remember him being all about the local church. He told my mothe that me and my brother would turn away from God if we left his church. Sick.

[TruthSeeker]

Holy Crap. I went to this church. I think my family went there for... 4 or 5 years, and and I remember him being all about the local church. He told my mothe that me and my brother would turn away from God if we left his church. Sick.

Can you tell me more about this pastor or church?

[JordanMaria]

(02-03-2011 04:48 PM)TruthSeeker Wrote:  Can you tell me more about this pastor or church?

It's a very small church. Pastor is typical fundy. I swear every time he preached he would somehow talk about how everyone needed to be in church every time the doors were open. EVERY time. I don't remember too much since I went during highschool and that was pretty much when I started to shut fundyism out. There was a very mixed congregation. Some very fundy, some not so much.He constantly talked about bringing people to church and never failed to have an alter call. No different from other fundy pastors.

While we were there, he started this Bible Institute video series every Wednesday before the service and he expected everyone to join. I hated it. It was an hr+ of Old Testament history and on top of that 2 hrs of service and prayer time.

All the kids that could play instruments were encouraged to play during the hymn singing. We had a little organ that I played, piano, flutes, trumpets, violins etc. There was quite a ruckus when we sang. lol

[Fred]

Landmarkers has the following marks. Since we are talking IFB they are independednt so things may vary but it will be close.
- NO UNIVERSAL Church.
- Closed Communion
- Strict baptist baptism- If anyone says alien immersion that is an indicator.
- Church did not start at Pentecost - Jesus started it with the 12 diciples.
- To avoid the label they may say historical baptist.
- The teaching of authority; The local church got its authority from another local church that passed it on to them. This chain of authority will go all the way back to Christ who gave the authority to the church. This will vary greatly due to different interpretation:
a) Unbroken chain back to Christ that can be traced - Trail of Blood - BH Carrol
b) Taken on faith since it is impossible to prove.
- Only churches can start churches. Without this you only have an assembly with no authority. They would not recognize most churches today because they come from Protestant Reformation and that is part of the Catholic Church. They would not recognize them as having authority. They will proclaim they were never catholic or protestant. They claim a separate unbroken chain from Christ.
- The Bride of Christ is NOT all of the saved. It is for those that are in true churches with the authority Christ passed on to them. All others will be the friend of the Bride, "John the Baptist" - Not in the Bride, he is considered a friend of the bride.
- No Spirit Baptism - Ephesians says only one church and one baptism.

There are several more indicators. These will stand out. I learned from one of the best landmark teachers I've ever seen. I held to this position for a while until I researched, studied and prayed.

[TruthSeeker]

My pastor believes in:

1. NO UNIVERSAL Church.

2. Church did not start at Pentecost - Jesus started it with the 12 diciples.

3. Unbroken chain back to Christ that can be traced - Trail of Blood - BH Carrol


Just this morning I asked my pastor about the Trail of Blood book and he told me it's a pretty good book. He is in the process of ordering more copies. I may be wrong but I think this finally confirmed the fact that he agrees with landmarkism.

Just like the KJV Only movement we need to recognize the differences between Baptist Successionism or landmarkism with Baptist Brider. Someone can be a landmarker but not necessarily a Baptist Brider.

Someone can be a KJV onlyist and not be a Ruckmanite. I view Pensacola Christian College, Hyles Anderson and others as Landmarkers. Landmarkers would hold to some of the tenants of Baptist Brideism. A Baptist Brider would be the extreme radical position of Baptist Successionism.

So based on the three points above, does anyone agree that my pastor is a landmarker? Also, I just study the issues of tithing and KJV Onlyism and it really exposed the IFB Movement. I now want to study this issue of "Landmarkism" can you recommended some good material on this topic?

[Darrell]

Quote: Church did not start at Pentecost - Jesus started it with the 12 diciples.

My dad and grandpa used to have roaring arguments over this one.

[Kevin]

(03-06-2011 07:40 PM)TruthSeeker Wrote:  My pastor believes in:

1. NO UNIVERSAL Church.

2. Church did not start at Pentecost - Jesus started it with the 12 diciples.

3. Unbroken chain back to Christ that can be traced - Trail of Blood - BH Carrol


Just this morning I asked my pastor about the Trail of Blood book and he told me it's a pretty good book. He is in the process of ordering more copies. I may be wrong but I think this finally confirmed the fact that he agrees with landmarkism.

Just like the KJV Only movement we need to recognize the differences between Baptist Successionism or landmarkism with Baptist Brider. Someone can be a landmarker but not necessarily a Baptist Brider.

Someone can be a KJV onlyist and not be a Ruckmanite. I view Pensacola Christian College, Hyles Anderson and others as Landmarkers. Landmarkers would hold to some of the tenants of Baptist Brideism. A Baptist Brider would be the extreme radical position of Baptist Successionism.

So based on the three points above, does anyone agree that my pastor is a landmarker? Also, I just study the issues of tithing and KJV Onlyism and it really exposed the IFB Movement. I now want to study this issue of "Landmarkism" can you recommended some good material on this topic?

I am going to have to echo Ex-IFB's remark: This church is probably too far gone. I would recommend leaving and finding a church that does not judge people if they miss a few services. This church is obviously kind of going the wrong direction.

[TruthSeeker]

"My dad and grandpa used to have roaring arguments over this one."


The funny thing is that my next lesson for Sunday school is the church. And according to the Sunday school material the church started at Pentecost but my pastor believes the church started during the earthly ministry of Jesus. I bet he didn't notice that the book disagrees with him.

[TruthSeeker]

Has anyone read "Baptist Successionism" by James Edward McGoldrick? Is this the best book dealing with landmarkism or Baptist Succcessionism?

[IFB No More]

So does that imply Landmark IFB churches will excommunicate a member if he attends and joins a non-IFB church since there is no way they will allow any transfer to a non-IFB group?